TS reports Appleworks out iWorks in

database app!! :eek:

Wow...if Apple put a sweet gui on top of MySQL would I be happy! I hope whatever it is, that its ODBC compatible.

If Document is as powerful as Word, then it will be very interesting to see how Apple plays with this new round of MS app killers. What Apple should do is bundle iWorks with every Mac just like they are doing with iLife. The thing that I find the worse is getting a new Mac and their is no word processing apps on it except if you get an iMac or an iBook. They really need to bundle this with the PMs and PBs.

Yes I'm most curious about the origins of teh DB and Spreadsheet.

I'm sure Document will be a decent app but I really need to beef up my Spreadsheet and DB skills inexpensively of course ;)

I like the fact that they're not "integrated" as well. Let them function well as a "Team" but when I only want to Word Process I want "just" that app open.

[quote]Originally posted by Mac OS X Addict:
<strong>Maybe instead of the paper clip they will have Steve Jobs as the Assisstant. :D

[ 03-15-2003: Message edited by: Mac OS X Addict ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

the steve jobs desktop assistant: "no, i said make it blue! bluer! you call that blue?!? what the hell am i paying you for?!?! what do you mean your readers don't want blue?!?! **** 'em! make it look like a goddamned sunflower!!!!!!"

p.s. i still like the idea of calling the word processing app "author," but i guess you could use that for a sound "authoring" app as well, which rumor has it they may be doing.

Point #1: They have a database app. It's called Filemaker. Most of the Filemaker community is aware that Filemaker 7 is due this summer and the app is being completely rewritten.

Point #2: There is no way that Steve Jobs will ever allow a piece of Apple software to leave Cupertino with a dreadful title like Document. This isn't Xerox we're talking about. Document is a codename or a placeholder title at best. Even iWorks sounds iffy.

Point #3: The only problem with this plan is that it still leaves a huge gap in the Mac consumer software line: iPublish. For a platform known for graphics, there remains no consumer software to put together a brochure, business card or newsletter. Ideally, Adobe would release a trimmed-down OSX version of Pagemaker for this purpose, but since they refuse to Apple should build a competitor for MS Publisher as part of the new suite.

Reason: Our newspaper uses InDesign in the layout department, but we would like to give our six sales reps the opportunity to do mockups while they are on sales calls with clients. And everyone is in agreement that we're not paying for six more copies of InDesign, which would be overkill. The latest idea is to use cheapo PC laptops with Publisher instead of iBooks. I can't argue the logic, so I've invoked the right to remain silent. :(

Now if these iPublish files could be read by InDesign, that's would be icing on the cake! :p

Originally posted by Frank777:
<strong>Point #1: They have a database app. It's called Filemaker. Most of the Filemaker community is aware that Filemaker 7 is due this summer and the app is being completely rewritten.</strong>

They can make a Filemaker Lite. Most people will need a simple database program, but not a whole battery of features.

<strong>Point #2: There is no way that Steve Jobs will ever allow a piece of Apple software to leave Cupertino with a dreadful title like Document. This isn't Xerox we're talking about. Document is a codename or a placeholder title at best. Even iWorks sounds iffy.</strong>

Yes, the article mentions that Document is a tentative name.

<strong>Point #3: The only problem with this plan is that it still leaves a huge gap in the Mac consumer software line: iPublish. For a platform known for graphics, there remains no consumer software to put together a brochure, business card or newsletter. Ideally, Adobe would release a trimmed-down OSX version of Pagemaker for this purpose, but since they refuse to Apple should build a competitor for MS Publisher as part of the new suite.
</strong>

That's something they definately need.

Couldn't you use Keynote for basic publishing tasks? I haven't used PageMaker since version 4.2, mostly because the consumer-level tasks that I once used it for are easily handled by PowerPoint. For designing simple things like posters, newletters, cards, etc, it would seem like any presentation software could do the trick.

Good point Towel.

I'm a writer, not a public speaker so I have close to zero experience with presentation software. Can anyone who does chime in on whether Keynote has the potential to fill this gap?

what i want...

automatic MLA formating for bibliographies!

i want you to tell it what the source is (book, webpage, newpaper ect.) and it ask u for the information...its impossible to remember, u need to constantly look in a packet for it.

[quote]Originally posted by ShawnPatrickJoyce:
<strong>This is great news.

As a college student and an English major in the Honors Program, I routinely churn out five to ten page papers. I obtained a copy of Microsoft Office *cough*, but who wants to use that? Apple iWorks will end my dependence on Microsoft for a key part of my college work.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Too bad you weren't just a regular student man, then AppleWorks might have been enough for you. But crap, for Honors work... yeah, you need Office.

:p

It appears we have dueling threads on this topic.

I vote for this one! :D

There is already a great desktop publishing app for consumer, but unfourtionatley its not well known.

Its called Creator, costs 99$ and is from a company called Multi Ad.
There are 2 version of the app, one pro and one consumer.

u can download a demo from: <a href="http://www.creatorsoftware.com/" target="_blank">http://www.creatorsoftware.com/</a>

Cheers,
calle

You know, I have to say that the website for Creator (mentioned above) isn't the best sales pitch for the product...you have to dig around for some screenshots of the app. Looks like an OS 9 app btw. Might be good, who knows?

I like the idea of a consumer database app.
Like it.

.

[ 03-16-2003: Message edited by: drewprops ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by ast3r3x:
<strong>what i want...

automatic MLA formating for bibliographies!

i want you to tell it what the source is (book, webpage, newpaper ect.) and it ask u for the information...its impossible to remember, u need to constantly look in a packet for it.</strong><hr></blockquote>
That would be a killer feature for me. I honestly think that making bibliographies always takes ten times longer than it should... this is the answer. PLEASE!!! :p

[quote]Has there ever been a "Works" package that people liked? ClarisWorks? AppleWorks? Microsoft Works? WordPerfect Works? No. For some reason people like having different programs for discrete functions.<hr></blockquote>

I liked ClarisWorks a lot. AppleWorks is a downgrade from it, but I still prefer it over Word due to its simplicity. I was going to buy Gobe Productive for Windows. I don't care whether an application suite is one file or several.

[quote]Originally posted by bradbower:
<strong>

I don't think that is any reason to discount this rumor. Keynote is interoperable with PowerPoint. iWorks will be intercompatible with Mac and PC Office, it *HAS* to be. How is that any issue at all? I don't know any schools that have PCs without Office (rather they have Macs with Office, too), and I know very few schools who have purchased AppleWorks for all of their PCs just becuase Macs come free with AppleWorks... that would be stupid, especially considering that Office walks all over AppleWorks in terms of usefulness and AW is totally outdated.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I didn't claim that there were thousands of schools that purchased Appleworks for PC. Rather I said it was a solution that allowed Apple to claim compatibility. The Appleworks could be for the teachers who have PC's at home. It doesn't really matter.

Microsoft cannot even make the Mac and PC version of Office completely compatible. Why wouldn't people be skeptical of Apple claims of compatibility.

Lastly consider that Appleworks costs $79 while Office costs $399. Appleworks licensing for crossplatform solutions is $19 per unit that it doesn't already come bundled with. (When ordering for 100+ machines)

Are we honestly to believe that an advantage like this should be tossed away or worse yet that Apple will misguidedly attempt to charge more for a solution that no one is seeking?

Keynote sounds like something they decided to sell because, well when you are the head of the company you can demand that an app be developed for you.

However Excel is a world beater on both platforms. I have heard people that absolutely hate Microsoft praise Excel. It is the world standard for a spreadsheet.

Word has very passionate defenders although I wouldn't feed it to my dog. However there are plenty of other options here. In fact it is likely that Apple kill some of the people and companies trying to develop for the platform because they need a few more pennies in their pocket.

Microsoft offers Office for $199 with initial purchase and Entourage for $99 as a standalone. (Claiming it will offer Outlook compatibility soon)

What would Apple gain besides antagonism? Outlook compatibility might be lost. Microsoft would either raise the price of Office (which makes it more expensive to purchase Mac's at universities and businesses) or leave it at $199 in which case where is the money for all this development?

Apple would need a word processor, spreadsheet, presentation and PIM/email package and also have to toss in Filemaker to boot just to be competitive. It is VERY unlikely they could bundle all of this with a Mac like they do Appleworks.

Office isn't the end all be all but for the folks that do $199 is a good enough price for the amount of software and peace of mind.

Apple is a niche company. They have to pick their niches carefully. Appleworks fits a niche well and there isn't another product that does what it does for $79. Trying to compete with Microsoft head-on at $199 or $399 is just asking for trouble in the worst way. Also it is a mature market segment that isn't growing anymore so why do it?

Apple didn't make a palm device. It is because they couldn't make a better Palm than Palm and even if they could, where was the money. They choose a niche with the iPod and have made out like bandits.

They could do it, but it doesn't help them, and it doesn't make sense.

Nick

Wow... It's even freeware. Thanks!

Its still MS office for me.

But it would be different if iWorks come free with 10.3 <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />

I don't think it's a matter of whether Filemaker will be used or not - of course it will. Apple owns Filemaker and won't spend valuable development dollars re-inventing the wheel.

The question is whether Filemaker will be part of 'iWorks', as the updated AppleWorks is being called. The answer, I believe, is no.

I think it's entirely possible that Apple will offer two distinct product sets in this space (remember, "there's a lot of software coming...") Apple (and the rest of the industry) breaks products into two sets, consumer and pro.

Thus we have:

iDVD and DVD Studio Pro
iMovie and Final Cut Pro
iPhoto and Photoshop

In the productivity dep't, we've had AppleWorks and MS Office.

The question is whether Apple is simply rewriting AppleWorks into a decent app, or going whole hog for BOTH segments.

Keynote and the Gobe team acquisition raised eyebrows because it seemed to imply the latter, but Apple has not confirmed this and their "we made it just for Jobs" excuse could be true.

This much is sure: Apple will not create a standalone Word Processor and Spreadsheet, throw in Keynote and Filemaker and bundle the whole shebang with the G5. That's economic suicide.

Most likely, Apple is working on both segments of the market, and will bundle a pared-down 'iWorks' with its systems and encourage users to pony up an extra $199.00 or so for an upgrade to the full suite.

From Spymac (http://www.spymac.com/)

New accounting application under development

Apple is said to be completing development on a new home accounting application that will be sold and bundled with other office products.

Whether or not the package will be distributed as "iWorks" is unknown, but both AppleWorks and Keynote will be included at a discounted price.

Said to be tentatively priced at US$250, Apple hopes to gain further independence from Microsoft with the low-cost and feature-packed suite. Other rumored components of the upcoming package include spreadsheet and database applications.

The accounting application's main focus will be to "manage your budget and analyze your spending habits," and will no doubt see tight integration with other Apple solutions.

"Later this year" is the only timeframe mentioned.
Yeah. We'll just have to wait and see.

Whether or not the package will be distributed as "iWorks" is unknown, but both AppleWorks and Keynote will be included at a discounted price.
Is it just me (?), or doesn't this sound strange to you people?
Is Apple making a new version of AppleWorks that is goning to be bundled with other applications like Keynote and iAccount in a package called iWorks or whatever? I don't think apple should make another integrated program suit like AppleWorks, but rather keep the programs separated from each other but with similar interface and some sort of opendoc-like funtionality that let the programs work together to create complex documents with text, spreadsheats, illustration aso. Other advantages is that they could split the package and sell the programs individually. If you just want iWrite-app, you just have to pay for that one.

Well - as I said before - we'll just have to wait and see what Apple has in store for us ;)

Is the gentleman from Intuit still on the executive board of Apple?

Whether he is or he isn't I wonder what the Quicken fellows think about this.

Screed

Originally posted by BHD2
There are a variety of robust open source databases. It would not exactly be "re-inventing the wheel" to use one of these (maybe PostgreSQL or SQLite, both of which offer unicode support) and add a Cocoa interface.

Absolutely. And there is a good open source productivity suite in the making called OpenOffice. If Aquafied (and optimised by Apple), it would make a formidable offering, not unlike what has been achieved with Safari.

With MS-Office now costing $499.95, hopefully, Apple picks up the baton.

Originally posted by Amorph
[quote]Originally posted by Frank777:
<strong>
Point #3: The only problem with this plan is that it still leaves a huge gap in the Mac consumer software line: iPublish. For a platform known for graphics, there remains no consumer software to put together a brochure, business card or newsletter. Ideally, Adobe would release a trimmed-down OSX version of Pagemaker for this purpose, but since they refuse to Apple should build a competitor for MS Publisher as part of the new suite.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Is there any particular reason AppleWorks wasn't up to the job? Of course it's not an InDesign replacement, but it's widely used precisely for brochures and newsletters and what-not, blending the WP and illustrator and paint (and spreadsheet, for graphs) frames as necessary. I don't see how a revamped replacement for AW wouldn't continue to offer that capability.

Does something really have to be narrowly and explicitly targeted at publication design in order to be useful in publication design?

ObThirdParty: Stone Design's Create. Deneba's Canvas.

Besides Stone Studio and Canvas there is MacPublisher (new to me and cheap). Nisus Writer for OS 9 could prepare documents that didn't require fancy graphic creation. The beta for OS X doesn't give any indication of what they will do for drawing graphics.