Categories: Misc / DotNet / Java / Coder / Linux / PHP Ask - La ask - La Answer

The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...

I didn't think it would be a problem at first, but in day to day use I'm amazed at how often I change volume without even noticing. A simple walk from a quiet car, through a loud parking lot and into a quiet office is 3 volume changes right there. But unfortunately a once simple (and unconscious) task is now unnecessarily complicated.

(BTW. Yes, you can double-click the home button to get "quick" volume adjustment but it's more of a shortcut than a solution. And no this isn't a design limitation because the iPhone loses no style points by having volume buttons, and the Touch isn't to thin to have a top button.)
[653 byte] By [mini.boss] at [2007-11-11 20:54:56]
# 1 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
Get ready to be flamed. If my experience is any guide, the fanboys aren't going to like this thread.
Surf Monkey at 2007-11-15 12:48:41 >
# 2 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
Yes I agree. Actually I sent Apple an email detailing an enhancement request. What Apple should do is to develop a "Broad Guesture" for the touchscreen so that you can make guestures on the screen without following any on screen interface element. For instance, if you wipe the finger from top to bottom, you lower the volume, if you wipe your finger from bottom to top, you raise the volume. If you double tap anywhere on the screen, you skip to next trace. Single tap, pause, etc., etc.. All without having to look at the screen and with the screen off.
pflau at 2007-11-15 12:49:41 >
# 3 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
As I use this primarily for video/web surfing, having a volume button doesn't matter to me, because when I'm using this I'm looking at it. Even when I listen to music, I'm normally listening while surfing the web. So no problems here. I can understand your point, but I gotta believe that Apple saw this being used more as I do, and less like a regular Ipod. I would assume they thought that with the IPhone, if you're on a call, it's important to be able to quickly adjust volume without having to tap into different screens.
sberger at 2007-11-15 12:50:40 >
# 4 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
...and with the screen off.

That's the problem. If the touch interface doesn't lock when the screen goes blank, it's likely to get erroneous input. That's one of the main drawbacks of the touch screen. It requires you to look at it in order to function correctly.
Surf Monkey at 2007-11-15 12:51:46 >
# 5 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
I can understand your point, but I gotta believe that Apple saw this being used more as I do, and less like a regular Ipod.

I seriously doubt that. iPod is a media player, not a communications device. If Apple saw most people using it like you do, they wouldn't have positioned it as an iPod.
Surf Monkey at 2007-11-15 12:52:45 >
# 6 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
I agree, its the one thing making me think twice about buying it, i played with one for about an hour and love it but i think taking the touch out every time i want to change track or volume will eventually drive me crazy!
I really hope they release a remote, it would sell by the truck load i reckon.
backtoipod at 2007-11-15 12:53:50 >
# 7 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
That's the problem. If the touch interface doesn't lock when the screen goes blank, it's likely to get erroneous input. That's one of the main drawbacks of the touch screen. It requires you to look at it in order to function correctly.

You just have the user double click on the home button first like you do now.
pflau at 2007-11-15 12:54:44 >
# 8 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
I agree, its the one thing making me think twice about buying it, i played with one for about an hour and love it but i think taking the touch out every time i want to change track or volume will eventually drive me crazy!
I really hope they release a remote, it would sell by the truck load i reckon.

The iPod Radio Remote should work fine with it.
Surf Monkey at 2007-11-15 12:55:47 >
# 9 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
I haven't bought a Touch yet (waiting for stores to get them), but I can see how not having a volume adjustment can be a pain. In fact I'm sort of concerned about it. For now the only solution I can think of is to use a volume control wheel on the headphones. There are headphone extensions which come with a volume switch, but of course this means you have to purchase another accessory and have a long headphone cable...but at least you can adjust the volume without using the touchscreen.
import_tuner at 2007-11-15 12:56:45 >
# 10 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
The iPod Radio Remote should work fine with it.

Which one is this? Not the one made by Apple, right? Cause I know that one won't work with iPhone or iPod touch.
Dim at 2007-11-15 12:57:47 >
# 11 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
I seriously doubt that. iPod is a media player, not a communications device. If Apple saw most people using it like you do, they wouldn't have positioned it as an iPod.

What I'm saying is that they probably didn't envision that most would use this as they do regular Ipod's, i.e. on the go, walking, running, etc. While people certainly can do that with this, it seems that if you would buy this primarily for it's wide screen and Wi-Fi, and not primarily to listen to music with. Therefore, since you're watching the screen normally, having physical volume buttons shouldn't be a big deal. And it isn't, for me at least.
sberger at 2007-11-15 12:58:45 >
# 12 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
Which one is this? Not the one made by Apple, right? Cause I know that one won't work with iPhone or iPod touch.

My mistake then. I was thinking about the Apple one. I hadn't heard that it was incompatible with iPhone and iTouch. Know what that makes me think? It doesn't work for a reason. I bet Apple is going to bring out a new remote for iPhone and iPod Touch.
Surf Monkey at 2007-11-15 12:59:49 >
# 13 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
What I'm saying is that they probably didn't envision that most would use this as they do regular Ipod's, i.e. on the go, walking, running, etc. While people certainly can do that with this, it seems that if you would buy this primarily for it's wide screen and Wi-Fi, and not primarily to listen to music with. Therefore, since you're watching the screen normally, having physical volume buttons shouldn't be a big deal. And it isn't, for me at least.

Ultimately, the issue here is that Apple didn't design iPod Touch as either a communications device OR an iPod. They made it iPhone Jr. so that people could get a taste and then begin to covet the big dog of the line. If they'd put even a marginal amount of thought into designing Touch as a true PMP it would have had the features necessary to make it a great companion to iPhone and a great "on the go" device. The fact that it doesn't satisfy the usual iPod criteria has less to do with Apple choosing to go in that direction than it does with Apple simply trying to get everyone to buy their new iPhone... even people who don't want a phone built into it.
Surf Monkey at 2007-11-15 13:00:56 >
# 14 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
My mistake then. I was thinking about the Apple one. I hadn't heard that it was incompatible with iPhone and iTouch. Know what that makes me think? It doesn't work for a reason. I bet Apple is going to bring out a new remote for iPhone and iPod Touch.

Just like they did with the video-out cable? I bought 2 at $19.99 for my old iPod and now if I want to do the same thing with the new ones I have to pay $50. So how much will that remote cost...

I honestly am not trying to hate this thing. I just find it odd that while the Touch can do many things you can't do on any other iPod, the problem is that the most basic of things you could do on any other iPod is suddenly complicated when doing it here.
mini.boss at 2007-11-15 13:01:51 >
# 15 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
What I'm saying is that they probably didn't envision that most would use this as they do regular Ipod's, i.e. on the go, walking, running, etc. While people certainly can do that with this, it seems that if you would buy this primarily for it's wide screen and Wi-Fi, and not primarily to listen to music with. .

But that contradicts the features of the device. If they envisioned this to be more of a video/internet communicator than a traditional "iPod" then why is it so crippled in those departments also?

Video: Sure a hard drive would make it slower but would anyone really complain about a slightly slower interface in trade for 80-160GB of storage and twice the battery capacity?

Internet Communicator: Full-sized browser with no flash means you are still missing out on a large chunk of content out there. And again, a drive would make it so this "internet device" could actually download files. But instead they decided to eliminate disk-mode entirely?

I'm not trying to argue with you and I'm glad it is exactly what you wanted. But it is very possible that you may be the one in the minority and the majority of people seeing the "iPod" name will want to use it as an iPod. The truth of the matter is that this couldve been everything but they chose for it not to. And that's a shame because while the software complaints can be addressed, the missing hardware is only solved with another $400.
mini.boss at 2007-11-15 13:02:56 >
# 16 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
My mistake then. I was thinking about the Apple one. I hadn't heard that it was incompatible with iPhone and iTouch. Know what that makes me think? It doesn't work for a reason. I bet Apple is going to bring out a new remote for iPhone and iPod Touch.

I had to try for myself to really find the answer. When plugging it in, a popup message comes up on the touch screen saying this device isn't compatible. I couldn't use the remote controls, or even the headphone jack off it, so it was rendered completely useless.
Dim at 2007-11-15 13:04:00 >
# 17 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
Video: Sure a hard drive would make it slower but would anyone really complain about a slightly slower interface in trade for 80-160GB of storage and twice the battery capacity?
To be fair, I'm confident the device would've had to fatten up considerably to be able to put in a hard drive AND even get the battery life to be the same as it is now. I for one, would complain if the device was more sluggish, as its speed is one of the most important aspects of the interface to me.

I do think it would've been nice to come out with both a flash-based and hard drive-based touch, but that was probably unrealistic in this time frame. That would've made it a tougher decision for me, probably would've still chosen the flash model because I do like the quieter, slimmer, more reliable flash.

Internet Communicator: Full-sized browser with no flash means you are still missing out on a large chunk of content out there. And again, a drive would make it so this "internet device" could actually download files. But instead they decided to eliminate disk-mode entirely?
Even without the hard drive, it would be nice to be able to download files from Safari. I hope they change this.
Dim at 2007-11-15 13:04:57 >
# 18 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
Yeah, we've discussed the HDD issue a lot. It seems to me that "thin" is the bottom line with all of Apple's design directions across all their product lines. The rumored MacBook Thin is a great example (assuming it does indeed come out). Adding thickness in order to stick an HDD in iPod Touch seems to run counter to the direction Apple is moving with everything.
Surf Monkey at 2007-11-15 13:06:02 >
# 19 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
Yes I agree. Actually I sent Apple an email detailing an enhancement request. What Apple should do is to develop a "Broad Guesture" for the touchscreen so that you can make guestures on the screen without following any on screen interface element. For instance, if you wipe the finger from top to bottom, you lower the volume, if you wipe your finger from bottom to top, you raise the volume. If you double tap anywhere on the screen, you skip to next trace. Single tap, pause, etc., etc.. All without having to look at the screen and with the screen off.

Hehe, this is so obvious, I can't believe more people haven't thought of it, i.e. people at Apple. I actually sent the EXACT same thing to Steve Jobs (steve@mac.com) himself. Here's a quote from my email:

So on to my suggestion.

Include gesture controls on the Touch. You still dont get (non-audio) feedback, but at least you can reach into your pocket and adjust the volume. Once switched to gesture mode (more on this later) the following controls would become functional:

Tap and drag from anywhere on the screens surface, in any direction =
volume adjust: towards the top of the Touch -> volume up, towards the home button -> volume down

Tap and release = play/pause

Double Tap = advance track

Thats it.

This is how I envisage it functioning (though of course, you should user test, like any good UI development would ;)):

State: Screen off
Double Tap Home Button -> gesture mode
Double Tap Home again to de-activate

State: Screen on / on any screen
Either: copy the states as above, with a visual cue to show the user theyre in gesture mode (dim the screen / overlay a gesture guide?)
OR: keep the current on screen mini-controls popping up (as on current Touch)
kazaorth at 2007-11-15 13:06:55 >
# 20 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
The Apple Radio Remote doesn't work, I have read because it needs access to the iPod menu for the radio part. I guess the new OS simply isn't compatible with the old iPod OS (not surprising.)

But...most car kits and docks with remotes seem to work fine at controlling the Touch (the Touch works fine with my Klipsch iFi.) That being the case-

There are a lot of cheap remotes on EBay that connect via the dock connector. They don't have radio, so if other controllers work, then I think these remotes have a good chance of working with the Touch (since these remotes don't need to access the iPod menu or anything fancy.) They are only $8 or $10, and generally come with a iPod Shuffle type control cluster.

I will probably order one of these after I get my Target Touch order, I had to return my Best Buy unit due to the screen.
madmaxmedia at 2007-11-15 13:07:57 >
# 21 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
That's can't be right. The new OS has a menu item for radio, just like the 5.5 did. I suspect that they've disabled it on purpose so that they can sell everyone a new design sometime later this year.
Surf Monkey at 2007-11-15 13:09:04 >
# 22 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
I would of loved it if apple just put two buttons on the side of the iPod touch for volume up and down. I also never realized how much I changed volume levels until I got my touch. On my video I would mess with the volume like crazy until it was perfect, then I got into a louder environment and had to mess with it even more.

It was very easy to change the volume on my video that's why I never realized how much I changed it. Now with my touch I have take it out of my pocket everytime, it would be nice if they added those general motions you guys were talking about.

Sorry about any grammar errors,I'm typing on my touch :D
a113524c at 2007-11-15 13:10:03 >
# 23 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
The Griffin radio remote works just fine on the Touch. I've been using it for the past couple days.
Heterocidal at 2007-11-15 13:11:03 >
# 24 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
Hey, wow! That's good news! Thanks!
Wilder_K_Wight at 2007-11-15 13:12:03 >
# 25 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
I've never missed them personally, as I've never owned an iPod with dedicated volume controls.

It's a bit puzzling why they were omitted on the Touch though other than to minimize costs.

I predict 32GB 1.5 gen touch this spring with hard buttons and speaker for yacking it up with the Youtube vids.
Gunner at 2007-11-15 13:13:09 >
# 26 Re: The lack of volume buttons are really becoming a problem...
The Griffin radio remote works just fine on the Touch. I've been using it for the past couple days.

Does anyone produce a slim inline remote that works with the touch?
Gunner at 2007-11-15 13:14:09 >
[an error occurred while processing this directive]
[an error occurred while processing this directive]