Sansa gaining huge market share? (19%) WHY?

What would make a person purchase a Sansa player over an iPod?You might find this hard to believe but not everyone wants an iPod(!)

The Sandisk Sansa e2xx series, which is the only one that really directly competes with any of Apple's models offer more features, expandable memory, it isn't tied into iTunes and is, apparently, cheaper.
The question would almost be why buy a Nano?

What you seem to have failed to realise is that not everyone wants the same thing from their DAP, so not everyone will find an iPod suits their needs.

A couple of iRiver's upcoming players seem very promising - the Clix2 being the most stylish of them.
So, if you're after something 'cool' it's probably worth a look.

You might find this hard to believe but not everyone wants an iPod(!)
Yeah, but do we worry about the fringes? :D

The question would almost be why buy a Nano
One don't question Zen. :D

so apple is going down...i thought it was 76%?

What's so surprising? Apple have a large market share because they have created a finely polished device that satisfies the needs for most users, but some (including me) cannot find all the functions in an iPod alone - a lot of the other devices are actually far more capable than iPods, just lack the image, value and ease-of-use. For most people it is easier to buy a device they know of and not need to do any research, rather than search round for something they've never heard of. It really comes down to the consumer.

What you have to realise is that the iPod is coming to the end of its life and is not where the future lies for Apple. Sales are already starting to slow which is why Apple are going into phones and the home with Apple TV. This is where the future lies, integration of multiple technologies into one device, being a hub throughout the home.

This isn't just Apple...even Microsoft are seeing this, cable companies (Virgin and Sky), TV stations (BBC and Channel 4). Apple probably is not that bothered what happens to the iPod and rightly so because there is a big change in technology at the moment that will effect us in years to come, those companies who embrace it and do it right are going to be the big winners and those who do it wrong will be the losers and many companies that have been household names for years will go out of business. It is too early to say who the winners and losers are, but Apple are definitely making positive steps to potentially becoming a big winner.

Don't get me wrong though, the iPod was and still is a great device, but that is technology for you. The companies who understand technology, the future and its customers are the ones who reap the biggest rewards. The walkman was great when it was released but it has been replaced numerous times by better technology. Same with the floppy disk.

Sansa may enjoy a brief growth period but I doubt it will be for very long when no one wants these devices and want the next device Apple (or some other company) brings out and it will take the Creative's and Sansa's of this world another 5 years to figure it out, by which time Apple has released another revolutionary product.

What you have to realise is that the iPod is coming to the end of its life and is not where the future lies for Apple. ... This isn't just Apple...even Microsoft are seeing this...Microsoft only got into this market four months ago, and they said their rationale was that the current number of users was a small fraction of the potential. What reason is there to think the TV market would obsolete the portable player market?

Sansa's share very well may be growing in percentage of players, but maybe not so much in revenue. They have several small form-factor mp3 players that are very inexpensive, and don't compete much at the high end.

Wildly speculate much? Sales are not slowing in an absolute sense. Sales may have declined post-Christmas, but they still shipped more than they did over the same period the year before. They will ship more this year than they did last, and will probably continue this pattern over the next several years. Most people are never going to need anything more than a nano, let alone the multimedia capabilities of the 5.X iPods, so all the different branches Apple and other may or may not branch out into will have nothing to do with the decline of the iPod or other DAPs.

In the 70s we had portable radios, in the 80s we had portable cassette players, in the 90s we had portable CD players, now we have portable mp3 players. Nothing whatsoever has changed beyond the specific media of the players and the devices will still be with us when I'm in a diaper, whether Apple is still a leader is undetermined, but portable audio devices have been around for ages and aren't going anywhere.

I do believe iPods have reached a saturation point. Most people who will ever think of getting an iPod have probably already got one. With the iPhone what would really be the point of carrying on producing the iPod? The iPhone has all the features of the iPod plus much more. The iPod has never really improved that much from each release, sure they have made some cosmetic changes, added extra storage and added things like video. However, lets be realistic here, the iPod as is will never be a serious video player. What are they going to do with the next generation? Just upgrade to 120GB add a few more colours? This isn't what Apple is about or any other successful company, flogging one product to death.

It is not just wild speculation. It has been in the news a lot recently about the convergence of the internet and wireless and also the growing emphasis companies are placing on moving into TV on-demand and converging the TV and the computer.

doenst the ipod have like 76% in hard drive based ones?

I think the growth must be driven more by the C-series than the E series. It is about price. Sandisk is well distributed, so it'll be visible. And the difference between the Shuffle is particularly stark: the bottom-of-the-range C240 has radio, voice recording and a colour display for much less than the Shuffle in many markets. To the more pragmatic and budget-conscious buyer, the C240 makes the Shuffle look rather silly to anyone not familiar with the iTunes integration.

who really cares. So long as I have the best products for my uses.

First, it needs to be mentioned that your referenced report is NOT about market share, it's about sales at electronics stores over the Christmas sales season. Apple is still holding onto the same 70% of the total market they have for ages.

However, it is true that Sansa is the number 2 DAP maker for the U.S. and that's because they've got a decent product at an even better price. Plus, the fact that they're seen as new and underdoggish compared to 'tired old dogs' like Sony and Creative can't hurt either in gaining the momentum they have.

Speaking only of hardware implemented features, it's actually pretty easy to find players that outstrip the iPod. The iPod's real strength is in the software of iTunes, and if you hate that like many do, you're definitely going to be better off with another manufacturer.

Since I like iTunes and smartlists, I buy iPods, but there are a lot of decent products out there.

I agree with a lot of what you posted above: While Sandisk does not market it's Sansa line with anywhere near the aggression that Apple does with it's iPod, Sandisk is basically as much a house-hold name in the computer & portable consumer electronics markets as Apple is, and they already have a nation-wide visibility in most major consumer brick-and-mortar stores that other DAP-makers do not enjoy (despite the fact that the inventory of iPod products that a customer may see in a Best Buy, Circuit City or Office Depot dwarfs what they'll find for Creative, Samsung, iriver, Cowon and Microsoft's Zune products, Sandisk products still dwarf iPod products).

I think it used to be in the past that non-iPod DAP's could be called as "easily" outstripping the iPod in feature sets, but that can't be easily argued anymore. Apple has been adding features to the iPod with every iteration, while it seems to me that rival DAP-makers are somehow "dumbing-down" their new products feature-wise, perhaps to more conform to the iPod in an effort to attract more market share. Basically more non-iPods are relegated to the "wav, wma, mp3" formats, and there are less attempts to introduce free formats like lossless codecs, DivX/XviD, AC3, etc. The 5.5 iPod has been out now since Sept. '06....where's all the new gapless-supporting DAP's that are supposed to follow it? Where are all the intuitive playlisting and DJ-ing features going? Why are DAP's sound qualities typically getting worse and worse??

The Sandisk Sansa sells because Sandisk can offer them at cheaper prices, and they hit most of the "check-boxes" for feature sets that most DAP-consumers want, even if they hardly hit home runs. There's really no feature of the Sansa that can be considered "outstanding", other than their market-leading flash capacity. A number of the features - like the video support on a tiny 1.8" screen - are basically no more than gimmicks, but they OFFER them, nonetheless. The mechanical scroll wheel (it IS a scrollwheel, not a "clickwheel") is fudgy at best, and was one of the biggest detractions (besides the early firmware bugs) for early owners, so that can't really be considered a plus for it's high market share.

I consider the Sandisk Sansa to be a "poor-man's" iPod: it's not as sexy, but it's design is "sexy" enough. It's readily accessible and adequately indiscreet.

I think the growth must be driven more by the C-series than the E series. It is about price. Sandisk is well distributed, so it'll be visible. And the difference between the Shuffle is particularly stark: the bottom-of-the-range C240 has radio, voice recording and a colour display for much less than the Shuffle in many markets. To the more pragmatic and budget-conscious buyer, the C240 makes the Shuffle look rather silly to anyone not familiar with the iTunes integration.

I actually believe the e200-series Sansa far outsells the c200-series. IMO, even the mono-chromed M200-series Sansa sell better. I know that the activity for e200 owners on DAP forums for Sandisk Sansas is far greater than posts for the c200 on several orders of magnitude, not that these sites give the best footprint for the average jogging, health-spa, soccer-mom consumer, but it's a good indicator...

I actually believe the e200-series Sansa far outsells the c200-series. IMO, even the mono-chromed M200-series Sansa sell better. I know that the activity for e200 owners on DAP forums for Sandisk Sansas is far greater than posts for the c200 on several orders of magnitude, not that these sites give the best footprint for the average jogging, health-spa, soccer-mom consumer, but it's a good indicator...

The M yeah - I forgot about that. I was thinking they discontinued them.

I think forums will see more e-series questions because you have to be at a certain level to access them.

This is proof that iPod sales are slowing...
http://blogs.business2.com/utilitybelt/2007/01/why_apple_needs.html

Proof? This is not a recognized publication but a journalist's opinion. When it comes to numbers anyone can find data to support whatever position they need. As code monkey stated the growth may have slowed, but not the sales themselves.

To resurrect an old thread here...

Just to show how much sales of iPods aren't slowing:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/6594131.stm

"Apple sold more than 10.5 million iPods in the first three months of 2007, helping the US technology firm to record an 88% increase in profits."

"Demand for iPods is up 24% on the same time last"

Honestly guys, get over it :rolleyes:
What the hell are you on? The only place there was any sort of rabid brand bias was against the iPod in this thread.

The trick is to be objective in ALL things. Trying to spin an out of context, largely meaningless data point into a platform that the iPod is losing marketshare when 100% of the actual facts counter this claim is the problem. Those are the people who need to get over something because they feel a need to find some way of shoring up their belief that the iPod is crap/in danger/will be de-throned any day now/etc..

This forum is filled with fanboys, this thread was NOT.

I don't see itunes disappearing anytime soon, so i could care less if apple is 100% or 0%. Sansa/microsoft can't uninstall my ipod or make it stop working right now. So if there is never a 6G because apple stops making ipod, then it doesn't effect me, i still have/use my 5G. If the apple ipod turns out to be the SOLE supplyer of DAPS in the future, it doesn't effect me, i still have/use my 5G.

Just because things can be integrated doesn't mean it works well. It might just be that separate devices are the simplest and smartest way to do things.

Words of wisdom people, take heed.

So your expectation is that your 5G will work until the day you die?

Maybe there'll be full convergence of phones and DAPs someday - people have been predicting it will happen "next year" for the past few years - but we're not even close. There are just all sorts of problems with the concept right now. The iPhone is high on the cool factor but a lot of people say they don't want Cingular. Are people really going to be happy with the notion of draining the battery and being unable to receive calls just because they decided to listen to music?

Just because things can be integrated doesn't mean it works well. It might just be that separate devices are the simplest and smartest way to do things.

If only the problem of power supply would be solved.

I don't see an attack. People are discussing a topic, so if you really have nothing to say aside from "get over it", then maybe you shouldn't post in here. I'm sure if we came to a thread you start about an xbox and ruin it with pointless comments you will get defensive as well.

This is a discussion of what people think about possible sales decreases. Nobody displayed any such emotion as caring.

LOL I knew this username would bite me in the ### later down the line. Just to clarify, it was made 3 years ago and I couldn't be bothered to make a whole new username...im more of a Nintendo person myself :p

Anyways, in terms of the topic..it seems as though I have gotten the wrong idea completely, so il let you guys get back to it :cool:

Most of them are of the male sex. Although this phenomena didn't originate with mac/apple, its a good example of fanboyism. ;)
You might try reading the thread for context the next time. The only Apple products I own are my iPods. I happily switched from Macs to PCs nine years ago and don't have any more loyalty to Apple than Microsoft (or any other corporation).

There actually are people who enjoy discussing the iPod/digital player market from merely an interested party p.o.v. without needlessly getting into the "my DAP is longer than your DAP" mindset that dominates these sorts of forums (regardless of brand focus).