3G EU Volume "Fix"
Hi All,
After many fruitless conversations with Apple someone (NOT Apple!) finally pointed me in the right direction:
Change the Volume Level for the songs on the iPod and it will quite happily go over the 100dB limit :-) In fact I change mine to about 160% and now normally listen to my MP3's @ 50% volume...
In Xplay this is a simple thing and can be done for all songs at the same time. Don't kno whow other apps handle this.
Cheers,
Stefan
[493 byte] By [
ewok666] at [2007-11-9 12:42:49]
# 1 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
anyone know a program for this?
# 2 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
works fine for me too with newest XPLAY release but it isn't that fair from apple to force users to buy external software to solve this problem on eu 3rd gen ipods ... they should find another way to fix this than delete posts in apple knowledge base or denial the prob ... got my first apple product and i'm totaly disappointed about that fact ...
dad at 2007-11-15 14:17:16 >
# 3 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
I think this has been discussed before, maybe in the Xplay forum. Itunes on Macs can do something like this. It is also a bit like mp3gain.
penbat at 2007-11-15 14:18:23 >
# 4 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Just d/l XPLAY and installed it turned up the volume on all my tracks on my Windows G3 Ipod and Im well chuffed have it on half volume now ..no need to take the lil bugger back
# 5 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
well, ive got a question then.. ive used mp3gain, and sure it works to turn it up, but if u turn it up too much u get ALOT of distortion (or whatever its called) and it sounds like ####.. how much i can turn it up before this happends depends on the song, but it aint much..
will this also happen in xplay, or does it work in another way?
fruxo at 2007-11-15 14:20:17 >
# 6 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
experiment that how i did it ....too much and it will distort
# 7 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
I used mp3gain, and even with a little vol. increase it distorted my mp3s so I couldnt even listen to them. Ended up taking the useless thing back.
M@rK at 2007-11-15 14:22:25 >
# 8 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
ya shoulda tried xplay
# 9 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
xplay must be doing something other than changing the global gain value of the mp3 file because with almost everything I have if I use mp3gain to increase the gain even slightly, almost everything clips horribly.
Does anyone actually know what xplay is doing (I own the latest copy)?
I suspect that whoever used xplay for this volume increase just doesn't hear how badly their music is clipping now.
sorka at 2007-11-15 14:24:25 >
# 10 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Originally posted by sorka
xplay must be doing something other than changing the global gain value of the mp3 file because with almost everything I have if I use mp3gain to increase the gain even slightly, almost everything clips horribly.
Does anyone actually know what xplay is doing (I own the latest copy)?
I suspect that whoever used xplay for this volume increase just doesn't hear how badly their music is clipping now.
I doubt xplay does ANYTHING to the actual data. It updates 2000 songs in a few seconds so it would be fair to assume that it only sets a flag in the ipod database. It's on the same screen where you set the EQ setting for the song on the ipod.
I just copied the same song a few times and varied the volume adjustment (with Xplay NOT mp3gain!) and I cannot hear any distortion.
This is the way I see it: You would get distortion and clipping if you manipulated the audio data by increasing the amplitude of the signal. As the loudest parts cannot get any louder than 100%...you get clipping. However, Xplay just tells the IPod to use more volume...bypassing the stupid EU limitation :-)
I suppose in a way the Apple guys were right when they said that the output was not limited....just the volume ;-) Not that they really understand what they're talking about!
Cheers
# 11 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
The global gain value in each mp3 file is a not part of the encoded data. The data is not modified, only the gain value which is a flag to the decoder to increase or decrease the volume *after* the decoding process.
mp3gain only takes a few seconds to update several thousand songs as well. I'm pretty sure that in the end, it is the same thing. I would try it myself right now, but I returned my 3g ipod because of the clipping problems.
sorka at 2007-11-15 14:26:33 >
# 12 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Doesn't raising the songs volume makes you peak?
px2so at 2007-11-15 14:27:31 >
# 13 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Originally posted by px2so
Doesn't raising the songs volume makes you peak?
Nope...as I said the volume of the iPod does not max out when you do this. It get's a LOT louder even on the already loud parts.
# 14 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
As i understand it mp3gain will increase volume on your PC mp3s.
Xplay will only increase volume on the Ipod.
penbat at 2007-11-15 14:29:34 >
# 15 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Surely the Xplay, Ephpod and musicmatch people must have the Ipod software source code. Obviously Apple endorse Music match but they didn't have to support the other 2.
penbat at 2007-11-15 14:30:37 >
# 16 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
I've just done some experimenting and I would say that Xplay's volume change works in a DIFFERENT way to Mp3Gain. You can up the volume in xplay without clipping. I just downloaded and installed xplay specially to find this.
I'm looking at the mp3 file (after pulling it back from the iPod) and I don't think xplay modifies the file. I think it must be doing something in the iPod database.
Thoughts anyone?
Graeme
# 17 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Im not really sure wot it does but Im happy with it untill a fix comes along
# 18 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Originally posted by neil67uk
Im not really sure wot it does but Im happy with it untill a fix comes along
The iPod maintains this iTunes database with information on all the songs it's got. In this it stores information like Genre, Artist, Album, Title, EQ Setting, Volume INDEPENDENT(!) of the MP3 file it references.
# 19 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
*blinks*
So I went to try this XPlay thing, but my computer crashed so I had to restart, then it said my trial was over, i havn't even used it 5 minutes yet!! Oi this is so unfair!!
TKS at 2007-11-15 14:34:33 >
# 20 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
So you can change "volume" for every EQ setting independantly?
# 21 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Originally posted by neil67uk
So you can change "volume" for every EQ setting independantly?
No, what I meant is that the settings are independant of the MP3 file.
# 22 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
ahh ok thanks
# 23 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
increasing the volume in xplay will not fix the eu volume restriction but will give you the chance to hear every song at the maximum (eu restricted) level.
that means that if you increase the volume with xplay on an song recorded allready with maximum volume level the ipod will not increase the volume from the level of maximum dB.
lemonstre
# 24 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Originally posted by lemonstre
increasing the volume in xplay will not fix the eu volume restriction but will give you the chance to hear every song at the maximum (eu restricted) level.
that means that if you increase the volume with xplay on an song recorded allready with maximum volume level the ipod will not increase the volume from the level of maximum dB.
lemonstre
That is not correct. I suggest you try this yourself. Of course, it will be even louder on a US iPod but the EU version becomes unbearably loud at 160% adjustment and on full volume.
# 25 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
So... if this XPlay method is a reasonable work-around would it be possible to replicate this function in a standalone utility or even change a global setting/flag in the same way?
Would that be legal? If you would be making a utility to do that one thing in the same way roughly as xplay would that be ripping them off?
# 26 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
Well. I've only done a quick test with the free version of XPlay but it seems to work a treat!
None of the clipping that MP3Gain gives you and ear splitting volume!
Perhaps Apple are keeping quiet as their PC iTunes software will have the volume option the same as the Mac software. That would seem like a reasonable solution. Not ideal but manageable.
I need to listen to more stuff to see if there are any drawbacks but initial impressions are WOW!
Thanks very much Stefan for pointing this out.
Steve
# 27 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
I think this thread has reached the following conclusion:
The iTunes database on the iPod does contain a method of boosting volume that is fundamentally different from what mp3Gain or other PC utilities do. It can do this on a per-song basis.
It also seems true that the only 3rd party app capable of modifying the iTunes volume is Xplay (Mac users can use iTunes directly to do the same thing).
3G PC users have the following choices at present:
Put up with the low volume
Pay to $30 use Xplay
The next thing to ask is whether those who wrote free-ware apps like EphPod would be willing to add the volume change functionality (even if it was a global setting) to their apps: this must be relatively easy as they are already directly reading from and writing to the iTunes database on the iPod.
Graeme
# 28 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
I've just got Xplay installed on my PC and adjusted the volume upwards. I notice that Xplay sets up various files including a database into an Itunes folder so it must be mimicking itunes as if it were available on a PC.
There were 1 or 2 comments about some distortion with a volume increased with itunes but not with Xplay. But they both work in the same way so which is it ? Distortion or no distortion ?
penbat at 2007-11-15 14:43:49 >
# 29 Re: 3G EU Volume "Fix"
There most definitely is a setting in the iTunes db on iPods. It's what "Soundcheck" uses.
MC9 just released this as well. You can now apply the replay gain as analyzed by MC9 to the iPod, it will do it automatically on every song, effectively normalizing your MP3s w/o you having to change the mp3 itself.
They also introduced a global db adjuster. So you can boost or lower the db level on all songs uploaded.
I never thought this would worked to fix the EU limitation as I thought that the limitation was restricting the amp output of the iPod (hence boosting db levels on songs would not have any effect).
So, it seems like it does work though.
Well, if anyone's using MC9, you can try that out as well.
Adam
